Monday, August 24, 2015

Valentine Collins .... Facts or Fiction ? Part 2

I've been going through all my files, years of research. I have one folder named 'bad_info' aka Hog Wash Files

I came across some comments left on a blog, that are so bad, I just thought 'Lord have mercy'.

This is no fault of the blogger, who I am acquainted with, as these are just comments on a blog post he made.

The blog post is named 'Valentine Collins Timeline', which actually was complied by Jack Goins, Penny Ferguson and my self, some years back. The links on this blog's article no longer are valid.

Here is a link to the blog post: Valentine Collins Timeline, there are 3 comments posted by the same person, that are not only chock full of misinformation, but border on being slanderous.

I'm going to  critique each comment, and make appropriate corrections

Comment 1:
"Pretty sure whoever Valentine Collins was he was one of my great grandparents-thusly, (1) his son Joshua who married Elizabeth Dale, had a child named Elizabeth Collins called Becky who married Matthew Bridgeman who produced a son Joshua Bridgeman who married Abigail Woodruff Hibbs and produced my GreatGrandmother Martha Elizabeth Bridgeman-Joshua and his family moved to Georgia in late 1800's and lost touch with the Hibbs children half siblings and the Collins family as well as the rest of the Bridgeman clan who resided mostly on the TN/VA border and Joshua told my Grandpa James Lee Thompson stories of being born in a home on the TN/VA line and not knowing for sure which state he was actually born in-and of serving in the Civil War in the Virginian militia.(2) I don't care who Valentine was but I believe him to be Native American and Hispanic as well as subsaharian decent as well as White. He is declared Lumbee and Saponi, I don't know if he is Vardy's brother but they are some relation because they followed each other from NC, to TN to VA to KY-back in that time they could not vote so there was power in numbers even if you were deemed Indian or Free men of Color or Mulatto (3) so family stuck together to the point that they finally decided to come to GA lots of the Collins family and just not talk about it. I married a Collins who is probably a very distant cousin and their story is hush hush as well,(4) Hiram Collins did indeed die in the Civil War fighting for the Union Army which is not discussed among Collins on his side> I did not know I had Collins ancestry when I married my husband.(5) THANKS ALOT COLLINS MESS!!! SIGNED GRANDDAUGHTER OF VALENTINE"

1. Yes Joshua Collins son of Valentine Collins did marry Elizabeth Dale on June 21, 1824 in Greenup County, Kentucky(my 3rd Great Grandparents), they did have a daughter named Elizabeth Collins, she was born in Floyd County ,Kentucky in 1843, I have no reason to believe she ever went by 'Becky'.

According to Johnson County Kentucky marriage records, she married James Madison Welch (served with 39th KY Infantry, Union Army), December 12, 1860. She died  January 10, 1903 in Johnson County, Kentucky. She did not marry Matthew Bridgeman, nor did she have a child named Joshua Bridgeman.

I did a little research and found that Matthew Bridgeman married Mary Elizabeth Collins in Washington County, Virginia abt 1834.

2. DNA testing is showing a small trace of Native American DNA,  but you have to 'dig' to find it, by downloading FTDNA atDNA raw data to Gedmatch and using their admixture tool. Y-DNA testing on 2 Valentine Collins lines (David and Joshua) are showing Haplogroup E1b1a8a , which is Sub-Saharan African .

I'd like to see this 'researcher' show a citation for Hispanic. I have no reason to believe that to be true.

What on Earth is 'White' ?

Declared 'Lumbee and Saponi' , by who ?  First of all the Lumbee Tribe of North Carolina, did not use the term 'Lumbee' until 1956. Valentine Collins never lived on or near the Lumber River, or Robeson County, North Carolina.

Saponi at best would be a good guess, but not fact.

Vardy Collins never followed Valentine Collins to Kentucky. Vardy stayed put in Old Hawkins County Tennessee, now Hancock County. As well, Valentine Collins stayed put in Eastern Kentucky. Could not vote ? I have no reason to believe Valentine Collins' voting rights were ever taken away, what a bunch of 'hog wash'.

3. Georgia ? That's so ridiculous ., I won't even make a comment.

4. Yes, my Hiram Collins (2nd Great Grandfather)  did die while serving with The 14th Kentucky Volunteer Infantry Company K, Union Army, he died of Typhoid fever. He served along side his 1st cousin Allen Collins, son of Joshua Collins.

Kentucky in the War between the States

As far as this not being discussed by this family, that is pure malarkey. How would this 'researcher' know this, she is not kindred to the Valentine Collins family. Shame on her.

5. Mess ? The only 'Mess' I see is the 'Mess' this person created for themselves. 'Granddaughter of Valentine Collins' ?, Bless her heart, but that ain't true.

Comment 2:
"one more entry I would like noted and (1) you will find this to be true of both Valentine and Vardy Collins they both have children and grandchildren named Hiram Collins and (2) they both have children who married into the Goins and Bunch families-(3)they both carry Portughese names such as Dicey and Lavisa as they married these women with these type name which my research has shown is of Portughese orgins-(4)both families claim relation to Daniel Boone and I have heard this all my life even though I don't recall hearing the name Collins mentioned but I did hear Bridgeman and Woodruff many times. (5)There are many circumstances that lean toward the blood relation of some type between Vardy and Valentine-once again signed-Valentines Granddaughter "

1. Yes Valentine Collins did have children and Grandchildren names Hiram, I have no reason to believe that Vardy Collins did, maybe this 'researcher'  can show the names and the documentation her statement is based on . I ain't gonna hold my breathe on that one.

2. Both ? Vardy Collins' line did, but Valentine Collins' line didn't. In fact, the 'mixing' with the Bunch and Goins families was pre -Valentine, this is shown in atDNA matches.

3. Does this 'researcher' know that Dicey is short for Ludicia ?  My research comes up with different conclusions.

Let's start with Ludicia:
"LUDICIA, LUTICIA - a variation of "Letitica" that seems to be unique to the American South. Examples can be found as early as the 1780's."

"DICEY - this was a nickname for several different names including Eurydice, Theodocia, Ludicia, and Diana.  Also used as a given name in its own right, especially in the 19th century."

This is information from a link that was sent to me by a seasoned Genealogist, a person who I trust, and  have no reason not to trust, in fact she is a Caudill cousin of mine, click here for a great 'name' site :  Female Names in the Upper New River Valley of North Carolina, 1700's to about 1850

Lavisa , I found to be of both Old English/Hebrew and of Danish origin.  I'd be interested in seeing the citations that these 2 names have 'Portyghee' origins.

4. Which both families ? I'm sure she didn't mean the Valentine / Vardy Collins families, that would be foolish. What connection do these Bridgeman, Wooduff families have to either the Vardy or Valentine  Collins line ? None that I know of. Danial Boone, give me a break !

5. Circumstances do not make for sound Genealogical research, in fact the opposite.

The connection between Vardy Collins and Valentine Collins is a work in progress. If there is a connection, it's through a female. Again Valentines Granddaughter ?

Comment 3:
"Collins in some these families here tend to fight then deny relation for some generations to come so that might account for some of this COLLINS MESS! They have children fighting on both Northern and Southern sides in the Civil War, this further opened any divides, as some went north and some went south. WE ARE ALL WHO WE ARE AND WE ARE SOMEWHAT THOSE FROM WHICH WE CAME-I AM NOT ASHAMED AS (1) I DID NOT KNOW THE CIRCUMSTANCES THAT seemed to have driven both Vardy and Valentine in life, they seemed to be constantly having to fight to keep the land they had and they seemed to be constantly defending their heritage to someone for some reason in four states, I think a lot just gave up and said what they thought people wanted to hear or said nothing at all. Deborah Thompson Collins"

1. What ? Both Vardy and Valentine Collins were big land owners. I don't know about Vardy, but I have no reason to believe Valentine Collins ever had to fight to keep his land holdings, again citations !!
Four States ?  Vardy Collins can be documented  in 3 States, Virginia, North Carolina and Tennessee, what was the 4th State ?

Valentine Collins was in 4 States, Virginia, North Carolina,Tennessee and Kentucky. Defending their heritage ?, what facts is that foolish statement based on ?

My conclusion on these 3 comments that were posted on a blog post named "Valentine Collins Timeline", is first of all, this person needs to take a refresher course on Genealogical research.

The only 'mess' there is, is the one she created herself. From what she has stated , she has a long way to go to prove she is "Valentine Collins'  Granddaughter", in fact she has proven the very opposite.

I wish her luck in her research and can only say, Bless Her Heart !

That's my 2 cents....

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